I don’t agree. Why shouldn’t we drink milk or cheese? They are some very healthy aliments, rich in Calcium. If people consume them for a few thousand years, and there wasn’t any loss in cow numbers, I think that this shouldn’t be a problem for anyone!
Don’t assume that milk and cheese are as healthy as they are made out to be. They both contain hormones that are fed to cows. These hormones are thought to be the cause of 11 year-old girls developing much earlier than they normally would. I look at it even beyond a health aspect, though. I don’t consume a cow’s milk, or any other animal’s milk, because it is not mine. By purchasing milk and cheese, veal factories are also being supported. That is just something that I want no part of.
Dairy products have never been consumed in the vast numbers they are consumed nowadays. Cows have been selectively bred over the past few hundred years to give higher milk yield, and we still have to resort to feeding them hormones to satisfy today’s market.
Traditionally, unless you lived in a dairy farming area, dairy products were expensive, luxury products, that you would eat rarely. I’ve heard old people still talk about cream like it’s an enormous treat, and my mother goes crazy for the stuff! In many of the poorer parts of the world (Mexico, India) dairy products are still rarely consumed.
Have you ever seen a mother parted from its infant? Have you ever been forcibly parted from a baby you have just given birth to and bonded with?
In my country there are problems with nutrients being leached from the soil because farmers are farming intensively instead of rotating crops or leaving land fallow. Farming cattle is an inefficient use of land. Cows also account for a fair proportion of greenhouse gas emmissions (!) Loss of cow numbers is not the issue: it’s quite the opposite!
From a health perspective, cheese and beef have been shown to imbalance some people’s blood sugar levels as badly as eating refined sugar, and diabetics are being advised to avoid them. Cheese is also linked to tension headaches. Then there’s the saturated fat content, the increased mucus production, the growing numbers of people who are allergic or intolerant to dairy…
11?! The lucky sods! 
I had breasts at nine! (My mother was part of the ‘eating dairy every day - every meal most days - to prevent osteoperosis’ brigade) If society won’t ban dairy, they can at least start making bras for children! 
That is early! I’d say that I was around 11. I agree with you about bras for children. I am sure that they are on high demand thanks to dairy 
. My mom is the same way with milk. She worries every day if I am getting enough calcium 
. She used to have to beg me to drink a glass of milk (even before I went vegan). I thought that it tasted so nasty. I was a cheese junkie, though, I will admit. Do you want to know something interesting that I read the other day? Supposedly, the reason that cheese is so addicting is because of the milk derivative casein, which mimics the effects of opiate drugs, such as morphine. I guess that this is why cheese is the most difficult food to give up. I am living proof of that. I have been craving cheese more and more every day. I can’t find any vegan cheese (besides Tofutti cream cheese) in my area. I have been pulling my hair out lately trying to find a vegan cheese 
. Anyway, I just thought that I’d share that.
Wow, I didn’t realise that about casein 
- I was a total cheese junkie too, I still crave pizzas and cheese ploughman’s (kind of a westcountry thing: some big chunks of the local cheddars or stiltons, with doorstep bread, hot chutney, pickled onion, maybe tomatoes or an apple, washed down with a pint of real ale or cider). 
If it’s any consolation to your mother, the British Heart Foundation and Diatetic Foundation have started recommending green vegetables (albeit as well as reduced-fat dairy) as a low-fat source of calcium. Maybe she’ll find it reassuring that vegetable sources are being recognised by the medical fraternity? Check this out: www.bda.uk.com
I’ve tried some hard cheese subsitutes (Cheezely) which were horrible beyond comparison - most cheese cravings can be negated with a splash of oil or some kind of sauce. Even my dear Ploughman’s dinners can be recreated with some olives and sundried tomatoes 
You can get a dry mix for a vegan cheese-flavoured sauce for lasagnes, etc. Otherwise, I think your body gets used to different types of food: I’ve actually started craving salad recently (I used to only eat salad if it was in a burger or kebab!)
Hmm, your studies on child development sound really interesting 
has there been a lot of research into the effects of dairy on young children? How do your lecturers and other people on your course feel about eating dairy? I have heard that a growing number of children are allergic to dairy: there was a programme on the TV about it a few months back. It’s quite a problem, because a lot of processed foods aimed at children use milk derivatives.
Starting from the age of 3 I believe, I’m not sure but I was still in the kindergarten. I couldn’t drink cows milk already. I ate cream and cheese but pure milk was something that would make me puke.
And those bastard in the kindergarten were forcing me to drink the glass of milk during the breakfast, which I was vomiting later on the table. 
Regarding the cheese crave… in my case it disappeared in a couple of months, starting from the moment when I decided not to eat cheese even on birthdays. Till then I would never buy it myself but when visiting someone, especially on birthday parties it was really difficult for me not to eat some 
The only information about the effects of dairy that I have read was in a chapter of our textbook about why breastfeeding is better for babies, but I have noticed that there is a LOT of research articles on the internet about the problems with dairy. Most of the people in my course agree that breastfeeding is better for babies, but I think that they still feel that children and adults should drink milk (probably because of the calcium issue). That reminds me, I will have to tell my mom about the vegetables! Thank you for that link .
I am almost sure that I am the only vegan in my course, but there might be others who just aren’t talking about it. I also heard about children being allergic to dairy. I have noticed in my area that all of the foods containing milk must have “contains: milk” written on the back of the container or package. I used to only see warnings about peanuts. With all of the information that is coming out, I don’t understand why people continue to drink and eat dairy products. It is strange, but I guess some people don’t believe it or just don’t care.
Andy, I felt the same way about milk. It tasted very 
ing. Did you folks over there in the UK have those little strawberry milk containers to drink with your lunch when you were younger? I remember I was always given them, and they made me want to hurl 
.
Oh, I feel for you! I was never a milk fan, I could only stomach it if enough chocolate milkshake powder was added to stop it tasting like milk I was lucky though, my Mum was put on a low fat diet when I was little, so we had skimmed milk: I could never stomach semi-skimmed or full fat milk, and I used to refuse to eat milk if it had lumps of cream in 
The government stopped giving milk to school children before I started going to school, but it was still subsidised, so you could buy a small carton of milk at break-time for something like 10p. I heard a few years back that a group were petitioning the government to bring back free milk for school children. And I was surprised to see a poster at my Doctor’s surgery offering free milk to pregnant women. The concern is that poor families won’t eat enough green vegetables to get calcium (the supermarkets mark up the price on fresh veg, so a lot of low-income families end up eating convenience foods). I don’t know why they don’t just promote green veg, but there you go… The nutritional education you get in UK schools is abysmal, a surprising number of people believe that milk=calcium, even last year there was a marketing campaign on the TV, and newspapers will often quote doctors who are worried that low-dairy diets will cause an “epidemic” of osteoperosis amoung women in the future. But it’s starting to change, with these celebrity chefs and nutritionalists giving people a better idea of nutrition.
Just saw a documentary called “50 Shocking Facts About Your Food” - The most shocking from my point of view is that it has been shown that, while it is still popular to believe that drinking milk prevents osteopeosis and brittle bones, there is now evidence to suggest that the inverse is true! 
Unfortunetley, I didn’t catch who had done the research, but I did find the attached on the web at thehealthierlife.co.uk/artic … bones.html:
Here the situation is even worse… many people just don’t care what they eat. :\ And those who care do believe that milk=calcium.
There are so many controversial researches lately…
Personally I believe that exercise isn’t the last factor in having strong bones.
I think this is very true. I used to have pain in my joints a lot, and I was told it was an precursor or early form of arthritus; my mother and my doctor told me to rest a lot, and not to do high-impact exercise. When I was a teenager I got fed up with being fat and never going out, so my Dad bought me a bicycle which we repaired together, and I went out cycling nearly every day that summer, as well as going walking with my Dad. My mother was horrified, and my parents argued a lot about it. But I lost a lot of weight and the pain in my joints reduced. I started going to the gym when I was old enough, and a gym instructor noticed that I didn’t walk properly (my thighs had been so fat that I sort of staggered) - he taught me to walk on a treadmill, and got me using weights, which helps strengthen your bones aswell as muscle. It was he who suggested I take up kickboxing. Now my joints hardly hurt at all, and I get to enjoy life too I suspect the pain was partially caused by my weight, or maybe something that I was eating… I don’t know if I might get arthritus badly when I’m older, but, I’d rather be in a wheelchair at 60 than have a heart attack at 40!
Which reminds me, I need to stop surfing the net so much, and bring my bike out of the garage for summer 
That’s not good 
I bet they care when they see those photos of you doing one-handed handstands
I know a few people who still behave like this: they seem to convince themselves that any health problems they have are genetic, or pre-ordained in some way. People often confuse a healthy life-style with extreme fad dieting and eating disorders. I even know people who consider themselves “above” being healthy, and think that they’re superior to people who are healthy - they laugh at people who do exercise, are proud of their huge bellies, and order unhealthy food as if to make a point 
I think they are sometimes jealous and insecure though 
That is so true… I so much hate when people leave their fate to their genes.
There are also those people that complain every day about how bad they feel and yet do absolutely nothing about it…
Regarding the bicycle 
Where do you usually ride it?
I went roller skating a couple of weeks ago, and the back wheel, which I usually use for braking, just broke in the middle of my skating…
imagine how i had to get back home!!
had no spare boots…
LOL!!! I can’t skate at all (no sense of balance at all!), but if I go out wearing high-heels I usually carry my trusty baseball boots in a bag for such emergencies Where do you skate - in the city?
Well, I don’t cycle much any more. The roads around here are still narrow and windy, but there are more people living here now so there are a LOT of cars. And people aren’t very bike-friendly either. So it gets pretty scary! Last year I started getting up early and cycling to work when the roads were still quiet, so I think I’ll start doing that again now it’s a bit warmer and lighter. But I REALLY want to get in shape and try some of the mountain biking trails round here - it looks so cool! Where I live now is fairly close to Exmoor, and the south coast and North Devon coastal paths. And I normally drive down to Cornwall at least once a year, which still has a lot of wild, unspoilt countryside (and surf!). I’m really lucky to live here, so I ought to make the most of it 
I’ve just been looking at these places on Google Earth - I can’t wait for the summer 
Yes in the city… but not on the roads… drivers are quite…hm… in a hurry around here…
I usually get to a place near a lake were I have plenty of space for skating.
…mountain biking… I’ve only dreamed of it
Milk is not a good source of calcium.
It does contain a lot of calcium but it also contains a lot of protein.
Excess protein prevents your body from absorbing calcium.
Therefore, time-average, you don’t get a lot of calcium.
I don’t drink milk because it tastes like crap unless it’s completely fresh and frigid in temperature. Both Cheese and Milk turn me into phlegm-boy.
Also, my family is a perfect example of those who consume such a diet.
I don’t drink milk or eat cheese because the cows providing it are mistreated and then brutally tortured and murdered. The same goes for eggs and honey. I do not believe that any animal or living being deserves to die or hurt in any way so that I can eat. If it doesn’t have roots or isn’t 100% derived from something that has roots (to include sea vegetables), I don’t eat it. I also don’t use any products in my home that contain any animal (or possible animal) products. Veganism is a VERY compassionate lifestyle. It can be hard sometimes in today’s world, but it’s a very important thing to do both compassionately and environmentally. The vegan lifestyle is worth everything that meat-eaters think that we’re losing out on. I find that it’s the meat-eaters that are losing out on. Come on, most don’t even know their basic grains because it’s just a side dish to them. Which is okay for them because that’s how they like it. But for me and my fellow vegans, we choose to love all beings as we love ourselves and our house pets.
I agree… That’s why they always say that breastfeeding is the best for babies…
The following information is from peta2 in an article called ‘Milk Drinkers: Try to Stomach This One!’;
‘Aside from the disg usting undercover investigation we launched earlier this week into a supplier for Land O’ Lakes—showing farm workers kicking and electro-shocking cows too sick to stand up—what’s another convincing reason to stop drinking pus, I mean milk?
The veal industry. Baby cows, because their mom’s milk ends up on store shelves, are torn from their mothers hours after they’re born and then kept weak and immobile in filthy pens for the entirety of their short lives. And if that fails to register your compassion or your di sgust, let’s try this: Veal just might be laced with poison.
That’s right—federal charges have been issued against Select Veal Foods Inc. for allegedly lacing feed with formaldehyde in order to lessen diarrhea and with potassium permanganate to ensure that the anemic calves’ flesh appeared even lighter. Wayne Marcho and Select Veal Feeds are expected to plead guilty to misdemeanor charges of misbranding under the Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act. The company also faces a felony charge for lying to Food and Drug Administration inspectors.
The moral of this story? Every glass of milk you drink has a little veal in it. Not only do you contribute to the suffering of an infant, you also risk eating toxic chemicals that you’d find in your high school chemistry lab. What can you do? Try veganism today!’.
I don’t think it mentions it here, but the cows are raped (with what is basically a metal rod with bull sperm in it) to produce the milk you drink - they don’t make it without a calf.
When they have the calf, it is then turned into veal (see above). Then, when they are milked, the metal machines are clamped onto their udders so tightly that they produce blisters and sores. The blisters produce pus, the sores bleed, and it all falls into your glass of delicious milk! Then, when all the blood and pus is gone, they scab up, and the scabs fall in too! Yummy!
Then, this delicious concoction of pus, blood, and scabs is turned into cheese, butter, and everything else with dairy in it. Including chocolate 
And don’t even get me started on eggs… haha
Thank you, phoebe200309
Unpleasant but effective article.
Because I hate the taste of milk. Also the female cows are being used. In order for them to have milk, don’t they have to go through the process of pregnancy first and then give birth? That’s kind of considered “rape.” If the female cows are fed poorly and are unhealthy, they would probably have a low drive to mate. Anyway, how would after-pregnant female humans would like it if their newly-born child is taking away and only to find her milk being drained away from her breasts? Eek.